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RE: [gnso-ccwg-dt] Cross community working groups

  • To: "Stéphane_Van_Gelder" <stephane.vangelder@xxxxxxxxx>
  • Subject: RE: [gnso-ccwg-dt] Cross community working groups
  • From: "Tim Ruiz" <tim@xxxxxxxxxxx>
  • Date: Thu, 26 May 2011 11:17:02 -0700
<html><body><span style="font-family:Verdana; color:#000000; 
font-size:10pt;"><div>Right, and I think this group should first come to 
general agreement on the principles, rules, parameters for CWGs and then wider 
agreement from the other SOs and ACs. Once we have a set of principles we all 
generally agree with, we can work on the necessary bylaw changes that may be 
needed to serve as recommendations for the Board.<BR></div>
<div>Also, I think it was Jonathan that suggested a SWOT (Strengths, 
Weaknesses, Opportunities, and Threats) analysis to get us going. I'm not sure 
we need a full blown one, but I think generally it could be a could structure 
for our report.</div>
<div>&nbsp;</div>
<div>Finally, since it's been some time since we've been discussing this on the 
list I thought I would attach two documents. One is the document created by 
Mike O'Conner based on his experience in the HSTLD group. I think he makes some 
very useful suggestions, especially for a CWG chartering process (or for any 
other for that matter). The other document is a text copy of the email note 
that Jeff Neuman sent regarding some principles that he felt were important, 
and that I happen to agree with.</div>
<div><BR>Perhaps next step would be to assign the "pen" to one of us to begin 
putting a report together, updating and circulating periodically based on 
discussions.</div>
<div>&nbsp;</div>
<div>&nbsp;</div>
<div>Tim&nbsp;</div>
<div>&nbsp;</div>
<BLOCKQUOTE style="BORDER-LEFT: blue 2px solid; PADDING-LEFT: 8px; FONT-FAMILY: 
verdana; COLOR: black; MARGIN-LEFT: 8px; FONT-SIZE: 10pt" id=replyBlockquote 
webmail="1">
<DIV id=wmQuoteWrapper>-------- Original Message --------<BR>Subject: Re: 
[gnso-ccwg-dt] Cross community working groups<BR>From: Stéphane_Van_Gelder 
&lt;<a 
href="http://stephane.vangelder@xxxxxxxxx&gt";>stephane.vangelder@xxxxxxxxx&gt</a>;<BR>Date:
 Mon, May 23, 2011 4:32 am<BR>To: Jaime Wagner - PowerSelf &lt;<a 
href="mailto:jaime@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx";>jaime@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx</a>&gt;<BR>Cc: 
&lt;<a 
href="mailto:gnso-ccwg-dt@xxxxxxxxx";>gnso-ccwg-dt@xxxxxxxxx</a>&gt;<BR><BR>Thanks
 for getting the discussion started again on this Jaimie.
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>I would add a question on the actual definition of a CWG in the bylaws. 
Currently, neither GNSO nor ICANN bylaws adequately define CWGs and this means 
that these groups are automatically in some sort of grey area. Hence some of 
the problems we've seen with them.</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>Thanks,</DIV>
<DIV><BR>
<DIV><SPAN style="WIDOWS: 2; TEXT-TRANSFORM: none; TEXT-INDENT: 0px; 
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<DIV>Stéphane</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV></SPAN><BR class=Apple-interchange-newline></DIV><BR>
<DIV>
<DIV>Le 22 mai 2011 à 17:12, Jaime Wagner - PowerSelf a écrit :</DIV><BR 
class=Apple-interchange-newline>
<BLOCKQUOTE style="BORDER-LEFT: blue 2px solid; PADDING-LEFT: 8px; MARGIN-LEFT: 
8px" type="cite"><SPAN style="WIDOWS: 2; TEXT-TRANSFORM: none; TEXT-INDENT: 
0px; BORDER-COLLAPSE: separate; FONT: medium Helvetica; WHITE-SPACE: normal; 
ORPHANS: 2; LETTER-SPACING: normal; WORD-SPACING: 0px; 
-webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; 
-webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; 
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px" class=Apple-style-span>
<DIV style="WORD-WRAP: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; 
-webkit-line-break: after-white-space" lang=PT-BR vlink="purple" link="blue">
<DIV style="page: WordSection1" class=WordSection1>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New Roman', serif; 
FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><SPAN style="FONT-FAMILY: Calibri, sans-serif; COLOR: 
rgb(31,73,125); FONT-SIZE: 11pt" lang=EN-US>Unless I missed something, the last 
msg on our list was this one on march 31.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New Roman', serif; 
FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><SPAN style="FONT-FAMILY: Calibri, sans-serif; COLOR: 
rgb(31,73,125); FONT-SIZE: 11pt" lang=EN-US>I understood we are expected to 
present a first report at the Singapore Meeting, but didn’t see sufficient 
discussions on the list.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New Roman', serif; 
FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><SPAN style="FONT-FAMILY: Calibri, sans-serif; COLOR: 
rgb(31,73,125); FONT-SIZE: 11pt" lang=EN-US><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New Roman', serif; 
FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><SPAN style="FONT-FAMILY: Calibri, sans-serif; COLOR: 
rgb(31,73,125); FONT-SIZE: 11pt" lang=EN-US>Some views and questions by way of 
“keeping alive”:<o:p></o:p></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New Roman', serif; 
FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><SPAN style="FONT-FAMILY: Calibri, sans-serif; COLOR: 
rgb(31,73,125); FONT-SIZE: 11pt" lang=EN-US><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="TEXT-INDENT: -18pt; MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt 36pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Times 
New Roman', serif; FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><SPAN style="FONT-FAMILY: Calibri, 
sans-serif; COLOR: rgb(31,73,125); FONT-SIZE: 11pt" lang=EN-US><SPAN>1)<SPAN 
style="FONT: 7pt 'Times New Roman'">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;<SPAN 
class=Apple-converted-space>&nbsp;</SPAN></SPAN></SPAN></SPAN><SPAN 
style="FONT-FAMILY: Calibri, sans-serif; COLOR: rgb(31,73,125); FONT-SIZE: 
11pt" lang=EN-US>CCWG reports directly to the Board should not be allowed in 
any circumstances. Reports should be to the chartering 
organizations.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="TEXT-INDENT: -18pt; MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt 36pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Times 
New Roman', serif; FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><SPAN style="FONT-FAMILY: Calibri, 
sans-serif; COLOR: rgb(31,73,125); FONT-SIZE: 11pt" lang=EN-US><SPAN>2)<SPAN 
style="FONT: 7pt 'Times New Roman'">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;<SPAN 
class=Apple-converted-space>&nbsp;</SPAN></SPAN></SPAN></SPAN><SPAN 
style="FONT-FAMILY: Calibri, sans-serif; COLOR: rgb(31,73,125); FONT-SIZE: 
11pt" lang=EN-US>Board questioning could be addressed directly to the CCWG 
afterwards? Or questioning should also be done exclusively through the 
chartering orgs?<o:p></o:p></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="TEXT-INDENT: -18pt; MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt 36pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Times 
New Roman', serif; FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><SPAN style="FONT-FAMILY: Calibri, 
sans-serif; COLOR: rgb(31,73,125); FONT-SIZE: 11pt" lang=EN-US><SPAN>3)<SPAN 
style="FONT: 7pt 'Times New Roman'">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;<SPAN 
class=Apple-converted-space>&nbsp;</SPAN></SPAN></SPAN></SPAN><SPAN 
style="FONT-FAMILY: Calibri, sans-serif; COLOR: rgb(31,73,125); FONT-SIZE: 
11pt" lang=EN-US>Are there scope limitations to the proposition of new 
CCWGs?<o:p></o:p></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="TEXT-INDENT: -18pt; MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt 36pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Times 
New Roman', serif; FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><SPAN style="FONT-FAMILY: Calibri, 
sans-serif; COLOR: rgb(31,73,125); FONT-SIZE: 11pt" lang=EN-US><SPAN>4)<SPAN 
style="FONT: 7pt 'Times New Roman'">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;<SPAN 
class=Apple-converted-space>&nbsp;</SPAN></SPAN></SPAN></SPAN><SPAN 
style="FONT-FAMILY: Calibri, sans-serif; COLOR: rgb(31,73,125); FONT-SIZE: 
11pt" lang=EN-US>Are GNSO Working Group rules applicable to guide CCWG working 
methods also?<o:p></o:p></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="TEXT-INDENT: -18pt; MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt 36pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Times 
New Roman', serif; FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><SPAN style="FONT-FAMILY: Calibri, 
sans-serif; COLOR: rgb(31,73,125); FONT-SIZE: 11pt" lang=EN-US><SPAN>5)<SPAN 
style="FONT: 7pt 'Times New Roman'">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;<SPAN 
class=Apple-converted-space>&nbsp;</SPAN></SPAN></SPAN></SPAN><SPAN 
style="FONT-FAMILY: Calibri, sans-serif; COLOR: rgb(31,73,125); FONT-SIZE: 
11pt" lang=EN-US>What is the process for these rules to be ratified as 
such?<o:p></o:p></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt 36pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New Roman', serif; 
FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><SPAN style="FONT-FAMILY: Calibri, sans-serif; COLOR: 
rgb(31,73,125); FONT-SIZE: 11pt" lang=EN-US><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New Roman', serif; 
FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><SPAN style="FONT-FAMILY: Calibri, sans-serif; COLOR: 
rgb(31,73,125); FONT-SIZE: 11pt" lang=EN-US><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New Roman', serif; 
FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><B><SPAN style="FONT-FAMILY: Verdana, sans-serif; COLOR: 
rgb(31,73,125); FONT-SIZE: 7.5pt" lang=EN-US>Jaime 
Wagner<o:p></o:p></SPAN></B></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New Roman', serif; 
FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><B><SPAN style="FONT-FAMILY: Verdana, sans-serif; COLOR: gray; 
FONT-SIZE: 7.5pt" lang=EN-US><A style="COLOR: blue; TEXT-DECORATION: underline" 
href="mailto:jaime@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx"; target=_blank><SPAN style="COLOR: 
blue">jaime@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx</SPAN></A><BR></SPAN></B><SPAN style="FONT-FAMILY: 
Verdana, sans-serif; COLOR: gray; FONT-SIZE: 7.5pt" lang=EN-US>Direto (51) 
3219-5955&nbsp; Cel (51) 8126-0916</SPAN><SPAN style="COLOR: rgb(31,73,125)" 
lang=EN-US><o:p></o:p></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New Roman', serif; 
FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><SPAN style="FONT-FAMILY: Verdana, sans-serif; COLOR: gray; 
FONT-SIZE: 7.5pt">Geral&nbsp; (51) 3233-3551&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New Roman', serif; 
FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><SPAN style="FONT-FAMILY: Verdana, sans-serif; COLOR: blue; 
FONT-SIZE: 7.5pt" lang=EN-US><A style="COLOR: blue; TEXT-DECORATION: underline" 
href="http://www.powerself.com.br/"; target=_blank><SPAN style="COLOR: blue" 
lang=PT-BR>www.powerself.com.br</SPAN></A></SPAN><SPAN style="FONT-FAMILY: 
Calibri, sans-serif; COLOR: rgb(31,73,125); FONT-SIZE: 
11pt"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></DIV></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New Roman', serif; 
FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><SPAN style="FONT-FAMILY: Calibri, sans-serif; COLOR: 
rgb(31,73,125); FONT-SIZE: 11pt"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV style="BORDER-BOTTOM-STYLE: none; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0cm; BORDER-RIGHT-STYLE: 
none; PADDING-LEFT: 0cm; PADDING-RIGHT: 0cm; BORDER-LEFT-STYLE: none; 
BORDER-TOP: rgb(181,196,223) 1pt solid; PADDING-TOP: 3pt">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New Roman', serif; 
FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><B><SPAN style="FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma, sans-serif; FONT-SIZE: 
10pt">De:</SPAN></B><SPAN style="FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma, sans-serif; FONT-SIZE: 
10pt"><SPAN class=Apple-converted-space>&nbsp;</SPAN><A style="COLOR: blue; 
TEXT-DECORATION: underline" href="mailto:owner-gnso-ccwg-dt@xxxxxxxxx"; 
target=_blank>owner-gnso-ccwg-dt@xxxxxxxxx</A><SPAN 
class=Apple-converted-space>&nbsp;</SPAN>[<a 
href="mailto:owner-gnso-ccwg-dt@xxxxxxxxx";>mailto:owner-gnso-ccwg-dt@xxxxxxxxx</a>]<SPAN
 class=Apple-converted-space>&nbsp;</SPAN><B>Em nome de<SPAN 
class=Apple-converted-space>&nbsp;</SPAN></B>William Drake<BR><B>Enviada 
em:</B><SPAN class=Apple-converted-space>&nbsp;</SPAN>quinta-feira, 31 de março 
de 2011 14:18<BR><B>Para:</B><SPAN class=Apple-converted-space>&nbsp;</SPAN><A 
style="COLOR: blue; TEXT-DECORATION: underline" 
href="mailto:gnso-ccwg-dt@xxxxxxxxx"; 
target=_blank>gnso-ccwg-dt@xxxxxxxxx</A><BR><B>Assunto:</B><SPAN 
class=Apple-converted-space>&nbsp;</SPAN>Re: RES: RES: RES: [gnso-ccwg-dt] FW: 
[council] Cross community working groups<o:p></o:p></SPAN></DIV></DIV></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New Roman', serif; 
FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New Roman', serif; 
FONT-SIZE: 12pt">Hi&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New Roman', serif; 
FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></DIV></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New Roman', serif; 
FONT-SIZE: 12pt">I'm in full agreement with Mr. Wagner-PowerSelf on the below 
points.<o:p></o:p></DIV></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New Roman', serif; 
FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></DIV></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New Roman', serif; 
FONT-SIZE: 12pt">Cheers<o:p></o:p></DIV></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New Roman', serif; 
FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></DIV></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New Roman', serif; 
FONT-SIZE: 12pt">Bill<o:p></o:p></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New Roman', serif; 
FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></DIV></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New Roman', serif; 
FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New Roman', serif; 
FONT-SIZE: 12pt">On Mar 31, 2011, at 3:06 PM, Jaime Wagner - PowerSelf 
wrote:<o:p></o:p></DIV></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New Roman', serif; 
FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><BR><BR><o:p></o:p></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New Roman', serif; 
FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><SPAN class=apple-style-span><SPAN style="FONT-FAMILY: 
Calibri, sans-serif; COLOR: red; FONT-SIZE: 11.5pt">My preference as to the 
liaison question: 1) Four liaisons as above; 2) Two liaisons, one of each 
house; 2) One single liaison. But the existence of a liaison or many does not 
preclude the CCWG which I think is a more effective mechanism to foster 
understanding (I’m not saying agreement).</SPAN></SPAN><o:p></o:p></DIV></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New Roman', serif; 
FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></DIV>
<DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE style="MARGIN-TOP: 5pt; MARGIN-BOTTOM: 5pt">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New Roman', serif; 
FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><SPAN class=apple-style-span><SPAN style="FONT-FAMILY: 
Calibri, sans-serif; COLOR: red; FONT-SIZE: 11.5pt">So, my position is to favor 
informal, individual GAC member participation in CCWGs, with the consideration 
that they are not representing formal positions of their countries but bringing 
an informed and legitimate point of view. Moreover, the same applies to GNSO 
participants in these CCWGs.</SPAN></SPAN><o:p></o:p></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New Roman', serif; 
FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><SPAN style="FONT-FAMILY: Calibri, sans-serif; COLOR: red; 
FONT-SIZE: 11.5pt"><BR><BR></SPAN><o:p></o:p></DIV></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New Roman', serif; 
FONT-SIZE: 
12pt"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></DIV></DIV></DIV></DIV></DIV></DIV></SPAN></BLOCKQUOTE></DIV><BR></DIV></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></span></body></html>

Attachment: HSTLD Position v2.pdf
Description: Adobe PDF document

--- Begin Message ---
  • To: William Drake <william.drake@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>, Stphane_Van_Gelder <stephane.vangelder@xxxxxxxxx>
  • Subject: RE: [gnso-ccwg-dt] FW: [council] Cross community working groups
  • From: "Neuman, Jeff" <Jeff.Neuman@xxxxxxxxxx>
  • Date: Thu, Mar 03, 2011 7:48 am 
 

1.  With respect to CWGs, I would like to point to the DSSA- WG charter 
(http://www.ccnso.icann.org/workinggroups/dssa-draft-charter-12nov10-en.pdf) as 
a model which makes it clear that following the completion of a final report, 
they shall be submitted to the respective SOs and ACs which shall discuss the 
Final Report and may adopt the Final Report according to their own rules and 
procedures.
 

2.  In addition, we need to be clear that CWGs are not part of the GNSO Policy 
Development Process as set forth in Annex A to the Bylaws and therefore cannot 
be used as the basis for the development of Consensus Policies which are 
binding on the contracted parties.  More specifically, for items within the 
so-called “picket fence”, such items must go through a formal GNSO PDP in order 
to be considered as Consensus Policies even if such policies have been vetted 
through a CWG.
 

3.  With respect to CWGs, it should be made clear that many members may only be 
participating as individuals and are not speaking on behalf of their 
company/entity/organization, nor are the speaking on behalf of their 
constituency/stakeholder group, advisory committee or SO.  Therefore, no one 
should interpret any of the statements of a CWG to have the support of their 
respective communities absent an express endorsement by those communities.  If 
a CWG were to speak directly with the ICANN Board or any other external party, 
this point should be clearly made.
 

Just to explain from a personal perspective, when I serve on any working group 
I am doing so as an individual and am not representing the views of Neustar (my 
employer), the Registries Stakeholder Group (my SG), or the GNSO (my Supporting 
Organization) unless my employer, SG or SO expressly endorse such statements.  
This is not just the case with respect to CWGs, but is also the case with any 
Working Groups in general.
 

This last point is critical in my mind for approving CWGs in the future.  To 
date there have been several CWGs where external parties have taken the word of 
the CWGs to represent the views of the community when they represented the 
views of the individuals serving on the WG and may not have represented the 
views of the communities from which they came.


Jeffrey J. Neuman 
Neustar, Inc. / Vice President, Law & Policy

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