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Re: [gnso-thickwhoispdp-wg] risk-assessment framework

  • To: Don Blumenthal <dblumenthal@xxxxxxx>
  • Subject: Re: [gnso-thickwhoispdp-wg] risk-assessment framework
  • From: Volker Greimann <vgreimann@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
  • Date: Tue, 05 Feb 2013 22:13:56 +0100


I think it happens all the time, but that would be beside the point as they agree to the new registrars agreement and thereby agree to provide him with their whois data.

Volker
Rick,

You make a good point that transfers of data from one registrar to another
might not be different from transfer in a thin-thick transition. However,
the jurisdiction issue here refers to companies based in different
countries. Do you have any idea how common it is for a registrant to move
a registration across a border when switching registrars?

Thanks.

Don


On 2/5/13 1:58 PM, "Rick Wesson" <rick@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

One point I believe folks are missing in the jurisdiction discussion
is that transfers of a domain from one registrar to another are
effectively moving this same information between jurisdictions. We
have had many millions of transfers in thin registries over the years,
many of which moved registrant data between  jurisdictions. We are
talking millions and millions of times, without incident.

I believe that it is as important to enumerate the volume and time
that this has occurred without notice, or catastrophe.

-rick


On Tue, Feb 5, 2013 at 10:19 AM, Alan Greenberg
<alan.greenberg@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Roy, some of us (or perhaps all of us) HAVE read the NCUC submission. It
talks a lot about potential problems with respect to privacy laws of the
Whois model. But they apply equally to both thin and thick models.

It also raises issues such as "ownership" of Whois data (the specific
sentence was "The movement of that that data, and ownership of that
data,
from a European, or Canadian, or Japanese, or Korean jurisdiction (among
regions/countries with strong data protection laws) to another country
(the
US) raises enormous issues."  I cannot recall anyone saying anything
about
ownership. As far as I know, we are talking about the USE of the data
which
is already publicly (and very widely) available.

If there are any restrictions (regarding revealing or making available
cross-boarders) to what a registrar may do with the data they collect
from
registrants, that problem exists today with a thin model. How does it
change
with thick? In both cases, they are widely broadcasting the data in a
way
that is universal and irretrievable. Once put on a whois server, it is
completely out of their control.

A specific example of how the models might differ in a real-life
scenario
would be useful.

Alan


At 05/02/2013 09:52 AM, Balleste, Roy wrote:
Perhaps the question should be, what new threats we have now have to
consider.  The Internet world has changed.  Any recommendations that
we make
will affect millions of users for years to come.
If I may, a suggestion, please read the submission from NCUC.

Roy Balleste, J.S.D.
Professor of Law
Law Library Director
St. Thomas University
16401 NW 37th Avenue
Miami Gardens, FL 33054  USA
1-305-623-2341


-----Original Message-----
From: owner-gnso-thickwhoispdp-wg@xxxxxxxxx
[mailto:owner-gnso-thickwhoispdp-wg@xxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Tim Ruiz
Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2013 9:44 AM
To: Alan Greenberg
Cc: Metalitz, Steven; Mike O'Connor; Thick Whois WG
Subject: RE: Re: [gnso-thickwhoispdp-wg] risk-assessment framework


Threats of exposure of Personal Information? Isn't the Whois system by
definition public? And in any event, how would this threat increase if
we
went from many down to one holding the information? Not being
argumentative,
just trying to understand what the threats are. Also, it seems if
there are
threats won't we encounter those as we go forward? Does there really
need to
be a separate exercise to identify them?


Tim


-------- Original Message --------
Subject: Re: [gnso-thickwhoispdp-wg] risk-assessment framework
From: "Rick Wesson" <rick@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Date: Mon, February 4, 2013 11:08 am
To: "Alan Greenberg" <alan.greenberg@xxxxxxxxx>
CC: "Metalitz, Steven" <met@xxxxxxx>,"Mike O'Connor"
<mike@xxxxxxxxxx>,"Thick Whois WG" <gnso-thickwhoispdp-wg@xxxxxxxxx>


I have yet to observe a single threat in both the transitions I've
participated over some 13 years of ICANN participation as a registrar
and service on the SSAC  -- in regards to the Escrow transition and
the registry transition for .ORG, both of which I actively
participated in.

If I had observed any issue that could be potentially identified as a
credible threat, in this regard, I'd be the first to raise it to your
attention.

-rick

On Mon, Feb 4, 2013 at 7:17 AM, Alan Greenberg
<alan.greenberg@xxxxxxxxx>
wrote:
Steve, I concur with your analysis. However, various posting have
claimed
dire results of the transition, and Mikey proposed that we do a
threat
analysis to try to understand how sever the problems is. Once someone
comes
up with a SPECIFIC threat, we can do this. If none can be construed
(as
we
both hypothesize), then the job is done.

Alan


At 04/02/2013 09:40 AM, Metalitz, Steven wrote:

These questions might be relevant to the Whois PDP that is slated for
this
year pursuant to the board�s November resolutions; but I don�t
understand
their relevance to our job.

At most the question would be whether the �threat� changes if all
gTLD
registries were thick --- but that would first require agreement on
what
the
�threat� is today.  This would be an extremely long path to take to
our
goal.

In any case, if the �threat� is �disclosure of non-public registrant
information,� then the threshold question is whether the transition
to
thick
Whois has any impact whatsoever on �non-public registrant
information.�
To
my knowledge the answer is no, and so all the subsequent questions
become
irrelevant.

If, as our chair has stated, �we're edging pretty close to Beijing
and
need
to think through what we're going to be able to deliver by then,� I
think
this type of excursion ought to be avoided.

Steve Metalitz
From: owner-gnso-thickwhoispdp-wg@xxxxxxxxx [
mailto:owner-gnso-thickwhoispdp-wg@xxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Mike
O'Connor
Sent: Sunday, February 03, 2013 7:30 PM
To: Thick Whois WG
Subject: [gnso-thickwhoispdp-wg] risk-assessment framework

hi all,

i promised to send along some materials extracted from the DSSA (DNS
Security and Stability Analysis) working group where i serve as GNSO
co-chair and day-to-day project leader.  this is in the "break a
large
puzzle into smaller pieces" department.

i've attached a one page summary of the process that we've been
working
on
(it's based on NIST SP 800-30 for you in the security world), and
thought
i'd build a list of questions that people could use as a starting
point
in
building risk scenarios associated with the transition from thin to
thick
Whois.

Questions:

-- What is the description of the threat event?  [1st-try, open to
editing,
guess -- "disclosure of non-public registrant information"]


-- What is the source of this threat?  [options/examples --
criminals,
governments, businesses, etc.]

-- What are the capability, intent and targeting of that threat
source?
-- What vulnerabilities might these threat-sources exploit in order
to
achieve their aim?  [categories -- managerial, operational or
technical
vulnerabilities]

-- Where [registries, registrars?], and how severe are these
vulnerabilities?

-- What is the likelihood that such a threat would be initiated?

-- What would the impact on the registrant be?

-- How likely is it that this impact will be felt?

-- How severe is the impact?

-- What's the range of impact (how many registrants would this be a
problem
for)?



if you want to read more about this DSSA stuff, here's a link to a
page
where you can download the final Phase I report;

https://community.icann.org/display/AW/Phase+1+Final+Report
and here's a link to a page where you can download an Excel worksheet
that
we've been developing as an alpha-test of this tool


https://community.icann.org/display/AW/Risk+Scenario+worksheet

thanks,

mikey








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