Re: [gnso-vi-feb10] RE: "livability"

[Avri Doria <avri@xxxxxxx>]

Hi Volker,

But this exception is only suggested for the first 50K names (all threshhold 
numbers in CAM are negotiable).  After that the equal access provision kicks in 
and the registrants are free to transfer any of those names and all new 
registrants come in from the whole field of willing ICANN registrars.

It does not abandon th equal access clause, but just gives a temporary 
exception to it.  The proposal is trying to find a compromise point that allows 
the new community Registry to get off the ground with a minimal investment in 
the larger Registry-Registrar support structure.  But once it is viable, and 
50k was (as a compromise between 0 and 100K that were suggested) defined as the 
viability mark.

a.

On 11 Jun 2010, at 10:34, Volker Greimann - Key-Systems GmbH wrote:

> CAM has in my view one major flaw as it abandons the equal access principle 
> for registrars and goes so far as to proposae no registrar is necessary even 
> for community TLDs, a position I just cannot sign on to. In its other 
> aspects, CAM has some very interesting ideas and proposals for a system of 
> preliminary checks, many of which bear consideration for implementation.
> 
> We still have a long way ahead of us with respect to buiding a system to 
> prevent, restrict or punish abuse prior to and after delegation and I see 
> many aspects from CAM's regulatory framework that would come into play at 
> that stage.
> 
> Volker
>> 
>> The way in which I can see someone living with the free-trade and not the 
>> CAM is if they don't believe there should be any regulation or controls, 
>> i.e. a completely - laissez-faire open system.
>> 
>> So when I checked both, I assumed the bottom-up policy driven imposition of 
>> some regulatory framework, but I can imagine that others do not want such a 
>> framework.
>> 
>> I think for some people that is, in fact, a big problem with the CAM 
>> proposal, that it contains an ongoing notion of regulation on the behavior 
>> of registrars in situation where there is co-ownership and affiliation with 
>> a registry or RSP.  Some do not like the idea of regulation in general and 
>> some do not feel it could be implemented in time to not delay the start of 
>> open season on gTLDS and think that CO limitations are good enough to do the 
>> trick.  I disagree, but I can see the points of view.  I once tried 
>> believing in a world without regulatory frameworks (really worked at since 
>> so many people I respected thought that way), but was taught  by experience 
>> that it doesn't work.  And I believe that the basic structure of a 
>> regulatory framework, as we described in CAM is enough to get started, 
>> though we would have to work hard over the next months to make sure the full 
>> initial policy was in place before the beginning of applications.
>> 
>> And while I have an extremely  strong aversion to ICANN making policy, I 
>> have an equally strong support of ICANN enforcing policy and believe it is 
>> something they can do effectively if the policy requires them to do so.
>> 
>> a.
>> 
>> On 11 Jun 2010, at 09:53, Milton L Mueller wrote:
>> 
>>  
>>> Another point (I am obviously in the process of filling out the poll)
>>> 
>>> The "free trade" proposal is not really a proposal but a philosophy or 
>>> approach. It says that we should have a more open market and that cross 
>>> ownership limits are not the proper tool for counteracting stated or 
>>> perceived harms. I agree. In this respect, it is identical to the CAM 
>>> proposal. However, it does not propose any specific method for preventing 
>>> harms. The CAM proposal does, proposing that any anticipated harms could be 
>>> checked by auditing requirements and by antitrust checks.
>>> 
>>> Thus, it is truly incomprehensible to me how anyone could vote that they 
>>> support or could "live with" with "free trade" proposal and "oppose" the 
>>> CAM proposal. It just doesn't make any sense. 
>>> I also wish to state that having this poll was a very good idea. Viewing 
>>> the selections is really an eye-opener and I think greatly advances the 
>>> dialogue. 
>>> --MM
>>> 
>>>    
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: owner-gnso-vi-feb10@xxxxxxxxx [mailto:owner-gnso-vi-
>>>> feb10@xxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Milton L Mueller
>>>> Sent: Friday, June 11, 2010 9:35 AM
>>>> To: Gnso-vi-feb10@xxxxxxxxx
>>>> Subject: [gnso-vi-feb10] "livability"
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> When we talk about whether one can "live with" the DAGv4 proposal, I
>>>> have one major uncertainty. My understanding is that DAGv4 ownership
>>>> limits and separations would ONLY apply to new applicants, and NOT to
>>>> incumbents and their existing TLDs. Thus, DAGv4 would prevent
>>>> registrars from having any significant ownership interest in registries
>>>> of new gTLDs, but it would not require Afilias/Neustar/VeriSign et al
>>>> to divest their existing ownership interests in registrars. Is that
>>>> correct?
>>>> 
>>>> Milton L. Mueller
>>>> Professor, Syracuse University School of Information Studies
>>>> XS4ALL Professor, Technology University of Delft
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>>      
>>>    
>> 
>> 
>>  
> 
> 
> -- 
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> Mit freundlichen Grüßen,
> 
> Volker A. Greimann
> - Rechtsabteilung -
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