Re: [soac-mapo] when is a domain name "incitement" that can be prohibited?

[Stéphane Van Gelder <stephane.vangelder@xxxxxxxxx>]

Hi Carlton,

My understanding is that France only considers itself insulted when the 
"representatives of the state" are insulted. But I am not a lawyer and 
therefore not an expert in such matters.

Stéphane

Le 17 janv. 2011 à 19:28, Carlton Samuels a écrit :

> On 2011/1/17 Stéphane Van Gelder <stephane.vangelder@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> 
> "The real crime here, as far as France is concerned anyway, being insulting 
> the nation and not insulting the person in question."
> 
> Hmmm, this is very interesting, this insulting a nation bit.  This is a 
> correct interpretation.....this is the law of France, not outlaw states like 
> say, um....North Korea...or Iran...or Cuba?  A whole nation?  How does one do 
> that, you suppose?   Maybe say stuff like 'the Eiffel Tower is an old piece 
> of iron....and not that tall anyways!'?  Or, recall the 'french fries' thing 
> on Capitol Hill back in the day?  Would that qualify as an insult to 
> France.......maybe, a 'casus belli' if somebody 'important enough' from 
> somewhere 'unimportant' were to utter them?  Would this make a good case for 
> across the board int'l acceptance..which is the central idea for a policy 
> vis-a-vis MAPO?
> 
> ...just thinking aloud......about that inerrancy mindset.....depending, of 
> course, on who you are and where you're from!! 
> 
> Helluva thing, power.....or the perception of it....
> 
> 
> ==============================
> 
> 
> 
> 2011/1/17 Stéphane Van Gelder <stephane.vangelder@xxxxxxxxx>
> Thanks Robin, very interesting and does seem of particular relevance to this 
> group's work.
> 
> I believe France has the same legal context as the US, i.e. it's only if you 
> threaten to kill the President that you are breaking the law. That may 
> however extend to any senior member of government, I am not sure. The real 
> crime here, as far as France is concerned anyway, being insulting the nation 
> and not insulting the person in question.
> 
> In any case, when threats of this kind are made against someone who is not a 
> member of government, even though it is not against the law, it may go 
> against our idea of morality. Public threats against anyone's life are 
> offensive to me, but that is a matter of personal ethics.
> 
> So I would not like a threatening gTLD to be allowed through ICANN's 
> application process unchecked. If that was a possibility, I would hope that 
> some kind of mechanism be in place to allow me to challenge that application.
> 
> Stéphane
> 
> 
> Le 15 janv. 2011 à 19:45, Robin Gross a écrit :
> 
>> Interesting real world development of relevance to the discussion on the 
>> legal standard of incitement / instigation to commit violence.
>> 
>> The words "kill x" alone is not incitement under US law that can be 
>> prohibited (unless x is Obama).
>> 
>> Robin
>> 
>> .........
>> http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/01/14/death-threat-domain-names_n_809174.html
>> 
>> Death Threat Domain Names: Registrar Says Killjulianassange.com Will Not Be 
>> Removed
>> 
>> The Huffington Post  Lila Shapiro Posted: 01/14/11 03:23 PM
>> 
>> BoingBoing has a quick post up today claiming that "Registering death 
>> threats as domain names is the hot new thing in psychopathic anti-Wikileaks 
>> action!"
>> 
>> According to vivantleakers.org -- a new site created to track 
>> "cyber-bullying domain names of wikileaks associates" -- multiple 
>> death-threat domain names have been registered going after Wikileaks 
>> director Julian Assange. Killjulianassange.com and julianassangemustdie.com 
>> are recently registered examples, although they have no content on them at 
>> this time.
>> 
>> Go Daddy, the site which registered both killjulianassange.com and 
>> julianassangemustdie.com said there is nothing that can be done about either 
>> site while they are contentless. Go Daddy registers a domain name every .8 
>> seconds -- any domain name can be registered and there is no human 
>> intervention.
>> 
>> "Unless and until there is content associated with killjulianassange.com 
>> there is no way for us to know what that means," said Christine Jones, Go 
>> Daddy's General Counsel. "There's no way to judge whether there's going to 
>> be something done with that domain name or if it is going to be violating 
>> any rule."
>> 
>> In the past week, Go Daddy has received numerous calls regarding the death 
>> threat domain names, but the company has no intention of taking action at 
>> this time. The one exception to this, Jones said, would be a domain name 
>> death threat for the President, "if the secret service contacted us, we 
>> would almost certainly take action on those domain names."
>> 
>> Assange is no stranger to death threats of the old fashioned kind either. In 
>> an online chat with the Guardian Assange wrote that anyone making threats 
>> against his life should be charged with incitement to murder: "The threats 
>> against our lives are a matter of public record, however, we are taking the 
>> appropriate precautions to the degree that we are able when dealing with a 
>> superpower."
>> 
>> Domain name attacks have become increasingly popular in a wide range of 
>> scenarios.
>> 
>> To prepare for an allegedly forthcoming WikiLeak which will supposedly 
>> reveal troves of highly sensitive information, Bank of America reportedly 
>> bought up scores of domain names that are critical of the bank and CEO Brian 
>> Moynihan.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> IP JUSTICE
>> Robin Gross, Executive Director
>> 1192 Haight Street, San Francisco, CA  94117  USA
>> p: +1-415-553-6261    f: +1-415-462-6451
>> w: http://www.ipjustice.org     e: robin@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> 
>> 
>> 
> 
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