RE: [gnso-osc] Another Attempt at a Final Response to the CCT

["Gomes, Chuck" <cgomes@xxxxxxxxxxxx>]

Would it suffice to simply call attention to Postel's theorem for
consideration by the CCT?

I think it is important to get a response back to the CCT. We have spent
enough time on this one point. The discussion has been good but we could
keep going on and in the meantime we have not responded to the CCT.  I
want to wrap this up today or tomorrow at the latest and will propose a
way to do that later today that hopefully is acceptable to all.

Chuck

> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-gnso-osc@xxxxxxxxx 
> [mailto:owner-gnso-osc@xxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Avri Doria
> Sent: Sunday, December 06, 2009 11:16 AM
> To: gnso-osc@xxxxxxxxx
> Cc: Scott Pinzon
> Subject: Re: [gnso-osc] Another Attempt at a Final Response to the CCT
> 
> 
> Hi,
> 
> I guess that points to my problem.  
> 
> 
> Civility is something that people think is due to them. I.e. 
> People should treat me with civility or else i will complain 
> to the ombudsman.  
> 
> The problem being that civility is defined within a cultural 
> milieu.  And as most things in ICANN the rules are not easily learned.
> 
> Tolerance on the other hand means accepting it, even when 
> someone treats me with what i consider incivility.  Tolerance 
> transcends the cultural limitation of civility.
> 
> Yes we should treat people with civility and should teach 
> this by example and without the threatened whip of an 
> ombudsman as the bogeyman who will get us if we behave with 
> what seems to be incivility by someone.    Bringing the 
> ombudsman into the internal operations of the volunteer corps 
> seems to me to be a really bad idea. 
> 
> But more importantly, we should behave with tolerance where 
> we remain civil even someone seems to treat us badly.
> 
> As I said, I go back to the variant of Postel's theorem as 
> the driving mantra for ICANN - be conservative in what you 
> send and liberal in what you accept, i.e. be civil but tolerant.
> 
> 
> a.
> 
> On 6 Dec 2009, at 16:28, Vanda UOL wrote:
> 
> > For me, both, explicitly have tolerance included or just 
> rely on the Ombudsman office will work. The most important 
> thing is really improve the level of civility in writing/F2F 
> or telephone communication or we will face a drop of 
> participation in ICANN challenging our capacity to accomplish AoC.
> > Best
> >  
> > <image001.jpg>
> > Vanda Scartezini
> > Polo Consultores Associados
> > Alameda Santos 1470 #1407
> > Tel - +55.11.3266.6253
> > Mob- +55.11.8181.1464
> > vanda@xxxxxxxxxx
> >  
> >  
> >  
> > From: owner-gnso-osc@xxxxxxxxx [mailto:owner-gnso-osc@xxxxxxxxx] On 
> > Behalf Of Ken Bour
> > Sent: Friday, December 04, 2009 3:57 PM
> > To: gnso-osc@xxxxxxxxx
> > Cc: 'Scott Pinzon'
> > Subject: [gnso-osc] Another Attempt at a Final Response to the CCT
> >  
> > OSC Members:
> >  
> > In the interest of continuing to make progress on the CCT 
> letter, I reinserted paragraph 4(a) and, following Chuck's 
> original suggestion, noted that the OSC is not unanimous on 
> this recommendation (see below).  All other edits were 
> accepted and comments removed (clean version attached).
> >  
> > For ease of reference, my suggested modification to 4(a) 
> follows... is this language be acceptable to everyone?
> > a)      Executive Summary Recommendations (last bullet 
> point) and 2.5.7 Degradation in Civility
> > Recommendation:  "Encourage the understanding of opposing 
> perspectives, while maintaining a spirit of cooperation and civility"
> > Comment:  Civility is clearly called for in ICANN's 
> Expected Standards of Behavior (see Section F); however, as 
> the organization begins to incorporate more diverse cultures, 
> some members of the OSC believe that increasing our tolerance 
> of others is also important.  Would the CCT consider a 
> modification to the recommendation, such as, "...maintaining a 
> spirit of cooperation, civility and tolerance"?  Note: The 
> OSC is not unanimous on this recommendation.  While some 
> members would like to see "tolerance" added explicitly, 
> others believe that the ICANN code satisfactorily embraces 
> this concept (e.g. third bullet beginning with TREAT) and 
> that the GNSO should adopt the standards as written or seek 
> to have them amended officially by working through the ICANN 
> Ombudsman office.
> >  
> > Ken Bour
> >  
> > From: owner-gnso-osc@xxxxxxxxx [mailto:owner-gnso-osc@xxxxxxxxx] On 
> > Behalf Of Philip Sheppard
> > Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 9:16 AM
> > To: gnso-osc@xxxxxxxxx
> > Subject: FW: [gnso-osc] Final response to the CCT
> >  
> > Chuck, yes indeed  apologies.
> > It should read:
> > Robin,
> > I do not understand your comment that the Ombudsman 
> principles fail to address tolerance.
> > See below especially paragraphs I've highlighted in blue 
> (bullet 3,4, 5 and 6).Isn't bullet 3 a definition of tolerance?
> > 
> >  
> > From: Gomes, Chuck [mailto:cgomes@xxxxxxxxxxxx]
> > Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 3:08 PM
> > To: Philip Sheppard; gnso-osc@xxxxxxxxx
> > Subject: RE: [gnso-osc] Final response to the CCT
> > 
> > Philip,
> >  
> > Did you man bullet 3?
> >  
> > Chuck
> >  
> > From: owner-gnso-osc@xxxxxxxxx [mailto:owner-gnso-osc@xxxxxxxxx] On 
> > Behalf Of Philip Sheppard
> > Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 4:07 AM
> > To: gnso-osc@xxxxxxxxx
> > Subject: RE: [gnso-osc] Final response to the CCT
> > 
> > Robin,
> > I do not understand your comment that the Ombudsman 
> principles fail to address tolerance.
> > See below especially paragraphs I've highlighted in blue 
> (bullet 4,5, 6 and 7).Isn't bullet 4 a definition of tolerance?
> > 
> > 
> http://www.icann.org/en/transparency/acct-trans-frameworks-principles-
> > 10jan08.pdf
> > Philip
> > -----------------------
> > F. ICANN EXPECTED STANDARDS OF BEHAVIOR Those who take part 
> in ICANN 
> > multi-stakeholder process including Board, staff and all those 
> > involved in Supporting Organization and Advisory Committee 
> councils undertake to:
> > * Act in accordance with ICANN's Bylaws. In particular, 
> participants 
> > undertake to act within the mission of ICANN and in the 
> spirit of the values contained in the Bylaws.
> > * Adhere to the conflict of interest policy laid out in the Bylaws.
> > * Treat all members of the ICANN community equally, irrespective of 
> > nationality, gender, racial or ethnic origin, religion or beliefs, 
> > disability, age, or sexual orientation; members of the 
> ICANN community should treat each other with civility both 
> face to face and online.
> > * Act in a reasonable and informed manner when 
> participating in policy 
> > development and decision-making processes. This includes regularly 
> > attending all scheduled meetings and exercising independent 
> judgment 
> > based solely on what is in the overall best interest of 
> Internet users 
> > and the stability and security of the Internet's system of unique 
> > identifiers, irrespective of personal interests and the 
> interests of the entity to which an individual might owe 
> their appointment.
> > * Listen to the views of all stakeholders when considering policy 
> > issues. ICANN is a unique multi-stakeholder environment. Those who 
> > take part in the ICANN process must acknowledge the 
> importance of all stakeholders and seek to understand their 
> points of view.
> > * Work to build consensus with other stakeholders in order to find 
> > solutions to the issues that fall within the areas of ICANN's 
> > responsibility. The ICANN model is based on a bottom-up, consensus 
> > driven approach to policy development. Those who take part in the 
> > ICANN process must take responsibility for ensuring the 
> success of the model by trying to build consensus with other 
> participants.
> > * Act in accordance with ICANN policies.
> > * Protect the organization's assets and ensure their 
> efficient and effective use.
> > * Act fairly and in good faith with other participants in 
> the ICANN process.
> > 
> 
> 
>