[gnso-policyimpl-dt] Attendance and Recording Policy and Implementation DT meeting - 17 June 2013

[Nathalie Peregrine <nathalie.peregrine@xxxxxxxxx>]

Dear all,

My deepest apologies for sending this out so late. It got stuck in my outbox.

I am sorry for any inconvenience this may have caused.

Kindest regards

Nathalie

*****************************************************************************************************

Dear All,

The next Policy and Implementation Drafting Team teleconference will be held on 
Monday 24 June 2013 at 1900 UTC.

Please find the MP3 recording for the Policy and Implementation Drafting Team 
call held on Monday 17 June 2013 at 15:00 UTC at:

http://audio.icann.org/gnso/gnso-policy-implementation-20130617en.mp3

On page:
http://gnso.icann.org/en/group-activities/calendar#<http://gnso.icann.org/en/group-activities/calendar#may>jun


The recordings and transcriptions of the calls are posted on the GNSO
Master Calendar page:
http://gnso.icann.org/calendar/

Attendees:
Holly Raiche - ALAC
Cheryl Langdon-Orr - ALAC
Mike O'Connor - ISPCP
Jill Titzer - RrSG
Chuck Gomes - RySG
Avri Doria - NCSG
Kristina Rosette - IPC
Jordyn Buchanan - RrSG
Wolf Knoben - ISPCP
Alan Greenberg - ALAC
Eric Brunner-Williams - Individual
Eduardo Diaz - ALAC
Greg Shatan - IPC
Anne Aikman Scalese - IPC

Apologies:
Brian Winterfeldt - IPC
Tim Ruiz - RrSG
Jen Wolfe - NCSG

ICANN staff:
Marika Konings
Lars Hoffman
Berry Cobb
Julia Charvolen
Nathalie Peregrine

** Please let me know if your name has been left off the list **


 Wiki page: https://community.icann.org/x/wiJ-Ag

Thank you.
Kind regards,
Nathalie Peregrine
For GNSO Secretariat

Adobe Chat Transcript for Monday 17 June 2013:

   Marika Konings:Welcome to the Policy & Implementation Drafting Team meeting 
of 17 June 2013

  Cheryl Langdon-Orr:Hi all

  Marika Konings:Please mute your phones / computers if you are not speaking.

  Eduardo Diaz:¡Hola a todos!

  Nathalie  Peregrine:Alan Greenberg and Edurado Diaz have joined the call

  Nathalie  Peregrine:Eric Brunner Williams has joined the call

  ebw:here now.

  Nathalie  Peregrine:They have been noted for attendance

  Kristina Rosette:And I've joined the DT, as of today.  :-)

  Nathalie  Peregrine:Greg Shatan has joined the call

  Alan Greenberg:Great echo, Cheryl.

  Avri Doria:i thought it was a done deal.

  ebw:remember names first when speaking.

  Cheryl Langdon-Orr:it is only 0510 here in SU

  Cheryl Langdon-Orr:AU

  Jill Titzer:yes I think so

  Cheryl Langdon-Orr:we *must *  work on GSO  WG  Guidlines !!!

  Chuck Gomes (RySG):Sorry about that.  I didn't realize that.

  Cheryl Langdon-Orr:GNSO

  ebw:"on" or "within" CLO?

  Alan Greenberg:How about "subject to"

  ebw:CLO's wording is "on".

  Alan Greenberg:No, we are a Drafting Team.

  Mike O'Connor:no we're a Drafting Team

  Cheryl Langdon-Orr:ARGH!!!

  Cheryl Langdon-Orr:we are JUST  as a Drafting Team *short like&*  creates the 
Charter for GNSO consideration/approval

  Avri Doria:it is good to call us a DT, since that is what we are.

  Cheryl Langdon-Orr:indeed @Avri

  Eduardo Diaz:I though we decided last time to hace the charter ready for the 
Durban meeting (I think it was by July 2 or 3)

  Alan Greenberg:For clarity, this DT does not have a formal charter for our 
own work. Out charter for OUR work is implied. We are to create the charter for 
the future WG.

  Chuck Gomes (RySG):@ Holly - Try to keep your eye on Adobe for raised hands & 
chat.  1st priority in my view is raised hands; chat is more challenging but 
still important

  Cheryl Langdon-Orr:EXATLY  @ Avri

  Cheryl Langdon-Orr:ExaCtly

  Cheryl Langdon-Orr:Your being FAR to democratic  Holly

  Avri Doria:all we actually do is produce a recommendation for the GNSO 
coucnil on a WG charter.

  Cheryl Langdon-Orr:YUP

  Avri Doria:we don;t have a charter becasue we are not a WG.

  Marika Konings:The 'charter' for this DT is noted in the call for volunteers: 
https://community.icann.org/display/gnsoplcyimplmntdrafteam/3.+DT+Charter

  Eduardo Diaz:From the call of volunteer we suppose to do:

  Avri Doria:the council does not really need a meeting to vote on a charter.

  Cheryl Langdon-Orr:Yup  @Chuck it *really needs to be on the GNSO Agenda IN 
Durban*

  Marika Konings:I've posted the proposed timeframes in the right pod

  Alan Greenberg:Well, we could have a practive that DTs need charters, and we 
could form a meta-DT to draft the charter for the DT, which in turn drafts the 
charter for the WG. Then we need to decide if that DT-Charter drafting group 
first needs a charter.

  Cheryl Langdon-Orr:Thanks Marika

  Kristina Rosette:The GNSO Council is taking August off? Seriously?

  Avri Doria:Alna, you are going to confuse thing with too many level of 
indirection

  Eduardo Diaz:@MArika: +1

  Marika Konings:@Avri - I do believe the Council needs a meeting in order to 
vote to approve the charter

  Avri Doria:the can't off line vote.  i thought we had that in the rules.

  Avri Doria:but as you say.

  Alan Greenberg:Don't beleive so Avri.

  Avri Doria:ok.

  Cheryl Langdon-Orr:OK  chuck not woiothstanding my irritation t being 
"managed by US "holidays"  in a global context ;-)

  Mike O'Connor:easy!  no problem!

  Cheryl Langdon-Orr:says the expert ;-)

  Avri Doria:i am all in favro of taking everybody's holidyas.

  Cheryl Langdon-Orr:hmmm that couod work  I'd get some paid stuff done that 
way ;-)]

  Avri Doria:i did not see them until now.

  ebw:leaving now.

  Marika Konings:Could the key assumptions serve as an introduction to this 
section?

  Mary Wong:Maybe a dumb question, but is it up to/within the ambit of the GNSO 
to determine "implementation processes" as part of its policy development role 
as envisioned in the Bylaws?

  Chuck Gomes (RySG):@ Avri: Good 3rd assumption

  Cheryl Langdon-Orr:agreed

  Chuck Gomes (RySG):@ Mary:  I think so.

  Mike O'Connor:Avri -- could you pound that assumption into the chat?  my 
internet dropped all the good stuff

  Alan Greenberg:@Mary,The GNSO was asked for input on policy and 
implementation, so I think it is all within scope.

  Kristina Rosette:@Mary:  Yes.  This issue came up when we were working on the 
domain tasting/AGP policy.

  Alan Greenberg:4 years of new gTLD AG development demonstrate that there is 
community input during "implementation".

  Avri Doria:ny was that we don't understand the relationship between the two, 
and that is something the WG will need to work on.  so i am looking for another 
assumption, we need to understand the relations.  And we need to eleiminate 
terms such as 'transtion' from stage to stage.

  Mike O'Connor:thanks!

  Chuck Gomes (RySG):@Avri: Is your last sentence the assumption?

  Avri Doria:ok, tow more assumptions. the realtionship bettween the two, and 
the multistakeholder nature of implementation

  Chuck Gomes (RySG):What are we assuming Avri?

  Avri Doria:not was it implementation, it was april fools implementation.

  Cheryl Langdon-Orr:Agree!!@Alan

  Jordyn A. Buchanan:+1

  Jordyn A. Buchanan:+1000, really

  Chuck Gomes (RySG):Not everything recommended from a PDP WG is necessarily 
policy.

  Chuck Gomes (RySG):PDP WGs may make implementation recommendations.

  Jordyn A. Buchanan:The WG needs to be clear about that distinction.

  Jordyn A. Buchanan:Because there's a lot of stuff that might look like 
implementation that is really policy because it's a careful part of the 
compromise that led to the recommendation in the first place.

  Alan Greenberg:Check, tat may be true. BUt I think that what level of detail 
the policy developers put into the policy is effectively their decision, and 
the rest becomes implementation.

  Alan Greenberg:Certainly a PDP may also recommend things that are best 
practices otr rec for staff or whatever/

  Chuck Gomes (RySG):The primary mission is to develop a WG charter for GNSO 
consideration.

  Chuck Gomes (RySG):@ Marika: Please speak a little more slowly.

  Jordyn A. Buchanan:Right.

  Jordyn A. Buchanan:Er, wrong window.  :-)

  Chuck Gomes (RySG):I should have said that the primary mission of the DT is 
to develop a charter.

  Chuck Gomes (RySG):The primary mission of the WG is to respond to the Board's 
request.

  Avri Doria:my two assumptions more: [17/06/2013 16:04:52] avri doria: 3. that 
we do not understand the relationship between practice and implementation, but 
need to establish a framework that takes the relationship between the two into 
account.[17/06/2013 16:05:38] avri doria: 4. that all processes, policy, 
implementaiton and the frameworks for interaction between the two, need to be 
MultiStakeHolder

  Marika Konings:Just to clarify - the language that Holly is reading now comes 
from the call for volunteers

  Avri Doria:ah, i have net seen the other.  my apologies.

  Nathalie  Peregrine:Anne Aikman Scalese has joined the call

  Marika Konings:@Chuck - can you clarify which board request you are referring 
to?

  Chuck Gomes (RySG):Didn't the Board ask for GNSO input on policy & 
implementation?

  Chuck Gomes (RySG):I would have to do some research to identify a specific 
request

  Alan Greenberg:I think that Greg has hit an important issue. It should not 
matter where the dividing line is, because the MSM needs to be used for both.

  Anne Aikman-Scalese:How does all of this relate to the recent request in a 
letter to the Board to amend the By-Laws to require ICANN Board to come back to 
GNSO if it goes against GNSO advice?  Isn't this all tied up with this upcoming 
Working Group?

  Chuck Gomes (RySG):Defnitely the Council formed asked for a WG so if there is 
not a specific Board request, the Council request would be the primary mission.

  Chuck Gomes (RySG):@ Anne:  Yes

 Mike O'Connor:Define the mechanism by which "policy vs implementation" 
questions are identified    - during implementation efforts    - prior to 
implementationDefine the criteria used to determine the difference between 
policy and implementation issuesDefine the options available for policy and 
implementation efforts and criteria for determining which should be usedDefine 
who makes those determinations and howDefine who reviews and approves those 
decisions and howDescribe the process by which this identification, analysis, 
review and approval work is doneDefine any changes needed to existing 
policy-making and implementation processes that are needed to support this 
approach.Respond to the Board and Council requests

  Cheryl Langdon-Orr:agreed  Agility *is* important here Marika  a point WELL 
made

  Cheryl Langdon-Orr:but nit at the cost of A &T

  Cheryl Langdon-Orr:nit=nOt

  Mike O'Connor:some of the rigidity is in the Bylaws

  Chuck Gomes (RySG):Are there any objections or edits to any of the input from 
Jordyn & I?

  Chuck Gomes (RySG):Does Marika need anything else from us for preparing a 
next draft charter?

  Alan Greenberg:Rigidity in how a PDP runs is in the Bylaws (and I have argued 
that they shouldbe more flexible). Nothing is in the bylaws regarding community 
involvement in implementation, and that is where a lot of the problem sits.

  Mike O'Connor:no i'm going to wait for Marika's draft

  Anne Aikman-Scalese:Chuck, - I apologize as I am new on this group and had a 
client emergency for the first hour - have not read your input yet.  Sorry, Anne

  Alan Greenberg:We have lost Marika!

  Marika Konings:I'm here!

  Alan Greenberg:Ahh. you disaappeared from my screen!

  Mike O'Connor:Marika can go first, i'll just join the "editing" parade

  Cheryl Langdon-Orr:Agree N=Marika

  Cheryl Langdon-Orr:Agree Marika  good plan'

  Mike O'Connor:one more thing to add is the additions to "assumptions"

  Anne Aikman-Scalese:@Chuck - can I just look at Marika's draft rather than 
going back to your original?

  Chuck Gomes (RySG):Anne:  Marika's doesn't include ours.

  Marika Konings:I'll update the charter to include Chuck / Jordyn's comments

  Mike O'Connor:but her new one will

  Anne Aikman-Scalese:Okay, I will check Marika's new draft which incorporates 
Chuck's and Jordan's Many Thanks!