RE: [gnso-reg-sgc] Draft Final Report of Sub Group C

[Tim Ruiz <tim@xxxxxxxxxxx>]

<div>Maria and all, to be specific:</div>
<div>&nbsp;</div>
<div>
1. I do not agree with either distinction. I am making that statement
for the record of level of support. My reason is that I feel neither one is 
actually enforceable.</div>
<div>&nbsp;</div>
<div>
2. I do not agree with Chris' and Lynn's changes. I am not suggesting
changes of my own (except for my 3. below), but I believe&nbsp;that the 
original report posted by&nbsp;the Chair more accurately reflects the WG's 
positions/opinions.</div>
<div>&nbsp;</div>
<div>
3. I am not offering examples of how registrars validate the
distinctions, as claimed in the report, because I do not know if any. What I am 
suggesting is that if that statement cannot be backed up with fact that it 
should be removed from the report. Alternatively, it could be restated with the 
appropriate caveat. I suggest that the last two paragraphs of the section on 
Natural or Legal Person be revised as follows:</div>
<div>&nbsp;</div>
<div>
"Some in the sub- group find this distinction operational in the sense
that the distinction is not difficult to make, and will not vary much between 
jurisdictions, though forms of legal persons may display such 
variance.&nbsp;Some believe it is capable of verification.</div>
<div><BR>
It was suggested by some that there should be some sort of verification
of the status declared by the registrar. It was claimed that some registrars do 
verify the status, or have implemented some sort of accuracy policy, although 
specific examples of such verification were not presented. The sub-group did 
not further pursue this issue."<BR></div>
<div><BR><BR>Tim <BR></div>
<div   name="wmMessageComp"><BR><BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE style="PADDING-LEFT: 8px; MARGIN-LEFT: 8px; BORDER-LEFT: blue 2px 
solid" webmail="1">-------- Original Message --------<BR>Subject: RE: 
[gnso-reg-sgc] Draft Final Report of Sub Group C<BR>From: "Maria Farrell" 
&lt;maria.farrell@xxxxxxxxx&gt;<BR>Date: Wed, May 30, 2007 10:38 am<BR>To: 
&lt;gnso-reg-sgc@xxxxxxxxx&gt;<BR><BR>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=785182015-30052007><FONT face=Arial 
color=#0000ff size=2>
At this stage we are now working on the second draft of the Chair's
report to the Working Group. </FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=785182015-30052007><FONT face=Arial 
color=#0000ff size=2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=785182015-30052007><FONT face=Arial 
color=#0000ff size=2>
It is very late in the day to roll back on the last several weeks of
this group's work. That is frustrating for people who have diligently 
participated in the calls and provided drafting work. </FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=785182015-30052007><FONT face=Arial 
color=#0000ff size=2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=785182015-30052007><FONT face=Arial 
color=#0000ff size=2>At this late stage, we need <U>
focused, constructive suggestions for specific changes to the
draft</U>. </FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=785182015-30052007><FONT face=Arial 
color=#0000ff size=2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=785182015-30052007><FONT face=Arial 
color=#0000ff size=2>
It is not enough to say you disagree with something - we need to hear
specifically what you disagree with (disagreeing with 'making a distinction' is 
not very helpful to a report which has two categories of distinction - do you 
disagree with either or both?) and how you propose to change the draft to 
reflect that.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=785182015-30052007><FONT face=Arial 
color=#0000ff size=2></FONT></SPAN><SPAN class=785182015-30052007><FONT 
face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=785182015-30052007><FONT face=Arial 
color=#0000ff size=2>
If there should be examples, then please provide them. Or&nbsp;ask
fellow&nbsp;constituency members for them. </FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=785182015-30052007><FONT face=Arial 
color=#0000ff size=2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=785182015-30052007><FONT face=Arial 
color=#0000ff size=2>
At this late stage, it appears that the agreements tentatively reached
by this group are unravelling amidst efforts to revisit the discussions in this 
report.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=785182015-30052007><FONT face=Arial 
color=#0000ff size=2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=785182015-30052007><FONT face=Arial 
color=#0000ff size=2>
Can we please focus on making specific changes to the report that can
factually and realistically attract the agreement of others? 
</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=785182015-30052007><FONT face=Arial 
color=#0000ff size=2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=785182015-30052007><FONT face=Arial 
color=#0000ff size=2>Maria</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=785182015-30052007><FONT face=Arial 
color=#0000ff size=2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=785182015-30052007><FONT face=Arial 
color=#0000ff size=2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=785182015-30052007><FONT face=Arial 
color=#0000ff size=2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=785182015-30052007><FONT face=Arial 
color=#0000ff size=2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=785182015-30052007><FONT face=Arial 
color=#0000ff size=2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV><BR>
<DIV class=OutlookMessageHeader lang=en-us dir=ltr align=left>
<HR tabIndex=-1>
<FONT face=Tahoma size=2><B>From:</B> Tim Ruiz [mailto:tim@xxxxxxxxxxx] 
<BR><B>Sent:</B> Wednesday, May 30, 2007 5:03 PM<BR><B>To:</B> Paul 
Stahura<BR><B>Cc:</B> Goodendorf,Lynn (IHG); Chris Gibson; Maria Farrell; 
gnso-reg-sgc@xxxxxxxxx<BR><B>Subject:</B> RE: [gnso-reg-sgc] Draft Final Report 
of Sub Group C<BR></FONT><BR></DIV>
<DIV></DIV>
<DIV>
Nor do I. The last thing we need are more policies that ICANN not only
doesn't enforce, but actually can't. And I question the statement that some 
registrars are verifying such a distinction. If so, I would think there should 
be some examples - the specific registrars who are&nbsp;doing it and how they 
are doing it.</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>
Also, I think the changes that Lynn and Chris are suggesting do not
accurately represent the level of support and/or agreement of the group.</DIV>
<DIV><BR><BR>Tim <BR></DIV>
<DIV name="wmMessageComp"><BR><BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE style="PADDING-LEFT: 8px; MARGIN-LEFT: 8px; BORDER-LEFT: blue 2px 
solid" webmail="1">-------- Original Message --------<BR>Subject: RE: 
[gnso-reg-sgc] Draft Final Report of Sub Group C<BR>From: "Paul Stahura" 
&lt;stahura@xxxxxxxx&gt;<BR>Date: Wed, May 30, 2007 9:58 am<BR>
To: "Goodendorf, &nbsp;Lynn (IHG)" &lt;Lynn.Goodendorf@xxxxxxx&gt;,
&nbsp;"Chris<BR>Gibson" &lt;cgibson@xxxxxxxxxxx&gt;, &nbsp;"Maria 
Farrell"<BR>&lt;maria.farrell@xxxxxxxxx&gt;, 
&nbsp;&lt;gnso-reg-sgc@xxxxxxxxx&gt;<BR><BR>
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<DIV class=Section1>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: 
navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">I do not believe a distinction should be 
made.<?XML:NAMESPACE PREFIX = O /><O:P></O:P></SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: 
navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><O:P></O:P></SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV class=MsoNormal style="TEXT-ALIGN: center" align=center><FONT face="Times 
New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">
<HR tabIndex=-1 align=center width="100%" SIZE=2>
</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><B><FONT face=Tahoma size=2><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 
10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma">From:</SPAN></FONT></B><FONT face=Tahoma 
size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma"> Goodendorf, Lynn 
(IHG) [mailto:Lynn.Goodendorf@xxxxxxx] <BR><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: 
bold">Sent:</SPAN></B> Wednesday, May 30, 2007 7:31 AM<BR><B><SPAN 
style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">To:</SPAN></B> Chris Gibson; Maria Farrell; 
gnso-reg-sgc@xxxxxxxxx<BR><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: 
bold">Subject:</SPAN></B> RE: [gnso-reg-sgc] Draft Final Report of Sub Group 
C</SPAN></FONT><O:P></O:P></DIV></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 
12pt"><O:P></O:P></SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=blue size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: 
blue; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">
I would just like to add a comment that I feel these revisions help
achieve the balance needed to win a broad consensus of 
support.</SPAN></FONT><O:P></O:P></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 
12pt"><O:P></O:P></SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=blue size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: 
blue; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">
Some members have not been as vocal in our discussions and I do not have
a sense of whether the majority of the group is in 
agreement.</SPAN></FONT><O:P></O:P></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=blue size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: 
blue; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">
Since we did not have a teleconference today, is it possible to have
some kind of quick informal poll?</SPAN></FONT><O:P></O:P></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 
12pt"><O:P></O:P></SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=blue size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: 
blue; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Regards,</SPAN></FONT><O:P></O:P></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=blue size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: 
blue; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">-Lynn Goodendorf</SPAN></FONT><O:P></O:P></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 
12pt"><O:P></O:P></SPAN></FONT></DIV>
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</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN-BOTTOM: 12pt"><B><FONT face=Tahoma 
size=2><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 
Tahoma">From:</SPAN></FONT></B><FONT face=Tahoma size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 
10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma"> Chris Gibson [mailto:cgibson@xxxxxxxxxxx] 
<BR><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Sent:</SPAN></B> Wednesday, May 30, 2007 
10:12 AM<BR><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">To:</SPAN></B> 'Chris Gibson'; 
'Maria Farrell'; gnso-reg-sgc@xxxxxxxxx<BR><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: 
bold">Cc:</SPAN></B> Goodendorf, Lynn (IHG)<BR><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: 
bold">Subject:</SPAN></B> RE: [gnso-reg-sgc] Draft Final Report of Sub Group 
C</SPAN></FONT><O:P></O:P></P>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: 
navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">
Sorry for the duplication &ndash; this message has the document
attached.<O:P></O:P></SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: 
navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><O:P></O:P></SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: 
navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Chris<O:P></O:P></SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: 
navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><O:P></O:P></SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV class=MsoNormal style="TEXT-ALIGN: center" align=center><FONT face="Times 
New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">
<HR tabIndex=-1 align=center width="100%" SIZE=2>
</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><B><FONT face=Tahoma size=2><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 
10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma">From:</SPAN></FONT></B><FONT face=Tahoma 
size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma">
 owner-gnso-reg-sgc@xxxxxxxxx [mailto:owner-gnso-reg-sgc@xxxxxxxxx]
<B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">On Behalf Of </SPAN></B>Chris 
Gibson<BR><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Sent:</SPAN></B> Wednesday, May 
30, 2007 10:04 AM<BR><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">To:</SPAN></B> 'Maria 
Farrell'; gnso-reg-sgc@xxxxxxxxx<BR><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: 
bold">Cc:</SPAN></B> 'Goodendorf, Lynn (IHG)'<BR><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: 
bold">Subject:</SPAN></B> RE: [gnso-reg-sgc] Draft Final Report of Sub Group 
C</SPAN></FONT><O:P></O:P></DIV></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 
12pt"><O:P></O:P></SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: 
navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Dear All,<O:P></O:P></SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: 
navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><O:P></O:P></SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: 
navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">
I have attached the draft final report for sub-group C with some
revisions marked in red-line, which Lynn Goodendorf and I propose.&nbsp; We 
believe these suggested changes are helpful to improve some of the writing, 
accuracy and balance of the report.<O:P></O:P></SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: 
navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><O:P></O:P></SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: 
navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Thanks,<O:P></O:P></SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: 
navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><O:P></O:P></SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: 
navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Chris Gibson<O:P></O:P></SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: 
navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><O:P></O:P></SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV><FONT face="Times New Roman" color=navy size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 
12pt; COLOR: navy">&nbsp; <O:P></O:P></SPAN></FONT></DIV></DIV>
<DIV>
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</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><B><FONT face=Tahoma size=2><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 
10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma">From:</SPAN></FONT></B><FONT face=Tahoma 
size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma">
 owner-gnso-reg-sgc@xxxxxxxxx [mailto:owner-gnso-reg-sgc@xxxxxxxxx]
<B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">On Behalf Of </SPAN></B>Maria 
Farrell<BR><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Sent:</SPAN></B> Friday, May 25, 
2007 2:12 PM<BR><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">To:</SPAN></B> 
gnso-reg-sgc@xxxxxxxxx<BR><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: 
bold">Subject:</SPAN></B> [gnso-reg-sgc] Draft Final Report of Sub Group 
C</SPAN></FONT><O:P></O:P></DIV></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 
12pt"><O:P></O:P></SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 
Arial">Dear all,</SPAN></FONT><O:P></O:P></DIV></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 
12pt"><O:P></O:P></SPAN></FONT></DIV></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">
Attached is the Final Report of Sub Group C, prepared by its chair, Jon
Bing. </SPAN></FONT><O:P></O:P></DIV></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 
12pt"><O:P></O:P></SPAN></FONT></DIV></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">
We agreed on this week's call to discuss any further - hopefully minor -
changes to the report using this mailing list rather than on a conference call. 
</SPAN></FONT><O:P></O:P></DIV></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 
12pt"><O:P></O:P></SPAN></FONT></DIV></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">
So please review this draft and circulate any comments on it to this
list. Please do use 'track changes' mode if you suggest changes to the 
document. </SPAN></FONT><O:P></O:P></DIV></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 
12pt"><O:P></O:P></SPAN></FONT></DIV></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">
We should expect to finalise this report next week and submit it to the
Working Group. I will also be adding some basic information to it about 
membership of the group and attendance. 
&nbsp;</SPAN></FONT><O:P></O:P></DIV></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 
12pt"><O:P></O:P></SPAN></FONT></DIV></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 
Arial">All the best, 
Maria</SPAN></FONT><O:P></O:P></DIV></DIV></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></DIV>