Re: [gnso-vi-feb10] Private TLDs

[Richard Tindal <richardtindal@xxxxxx>]

Understood.     As discussed, I think we already have a solution for the single 
registrant/ brand registry -- as long as their intent is to own and use second 
level names themselves.   If they want to offer names for customers' use then 
we need more discussion.

As an aside, I will be amazed if there is a single speculative application for 
a more generic brand with the intent of being bought off by the brand owner.   
Its way too expensive and risky for speculators to do this.   There are much 
more productive ways for them to speculate with $185K+ than going through the 
gauntlet of a TLD application.

RT

On Mar 26, 2010, at 6:52 AM, Mustala, Tero (NSN - FI/Espoo) wrote:

> Richard,
>  
>  
> I just want to comment your higher-level question: The fact that companies 
> are not advocating the possibilities for new TLDs does not necessarily mean, 
> that nobody would be seriously considering it. For commercial companies the 
> arguments to consider applying for a "Brand TLD" may often be related to the 
> value of the brand. Either to increase the value with own TLD or in a 
> preventive plan just to ensure, that nobody else would get the TLD of 
> identical string with the brand.
>  
> In both cases it would not be wise to publish the interest or intentions in 
> too early phase, especially as the schedule for these new TLDs has been open 
> for long time and still is. Such actions would just increase the risk to 
> speculative applications leading to costly auctions. The cost related to new 
> TLDs are already high enough without any possible auctions. So lack of public 
> announcements does not necessarily equal to lack of interest.
>  
> with best regards
>  
> Tero
>  
> Tero Mustala 
> Principal Consultant, 
> CTO/Industry Environment 
> Nokia Siemens Networks 
> tero.mustala@xxxxxxx
> 
> 
> From: owner-gnso-vi-feb10@xxxxxxxxx [mailto:owner-gnso-vi-feb10@xxxxxxxxx] On 
> Behalf Of ext Richard Tindal
> Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 7:52 PM
> To: Van Couvering Antony; Gnso-vi-feb10@xxxxxxxxx
> Subject: Re: [gnso-vi-feb10] Private TLDs
> 
> Antony has identified a challenge with the single-registrant model.    
> 
> To re-state it, I could operate as the  Music Domains 'brand', apply for 
> .MUSIC,  provide second level MUSIC names to worldwide customers, have myself 
> as the registrant for all those names (but give customers a license to use ) 
> and circumvent any equivalent registrar access and/or registrar fee rules 
> that might be in place for other TLDs.
> 
> Jarkko/ All  - Is a solution to this putting a numerical limit on the number 
> of second level names that can be registered?  Lets say the limit was 1,000 
> names.  This should give the 'brand' the ability to run its own marketing 
> sites - e.g.    newproducts.nokia,   phones.nokia,  employment.nokia,   
> news.nokia,  etc.      
> 
> What the 1,000 name limit wouldn't do is allow Nokia to sell/ bundle/ 
> giveaway names to customers.    I dont see a solution to that perceived need  
> (although others may).    In fact,  I dont know why Nokia should be any 
> different from any other registry if it was providing names to registrants.   
>  
> 
> At a higher level of questioning ---   Are any brands really planning to do 
> that?    In the last 3 years of public comments on new TLDs I havent seen or 
> heard one comment from a 'brand' advocating that model?    What I have seen 
> is almost uniform comments from 'brands' that new TLDs are not necessary and 
> are not justified by economic analysis.  I dont mind working to find a 
> solution for the 'brand' issue but I wouldnt want us to spend a lot of time 
> working on a solution for a group who have not been asking for a solution.  
> 
> RT
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On Mar 25, 2010, at 11:16 AM, Antony Van Couvering wrote:
> 
>> Apologies for having to ask this, but what is a brand?
>> 
>> If it's anyone with a trademark, then the obvious thing to do if you want to 
>> avoid the registrar channel is get a trademark, "license" the names out 
>> (isn't this the legal fiction anyway?), and avoid all ICANN fees and other 
>> pesky restrictions....
>> 
>> Consider also a sports franchise (say the NBA) or an automobile manufacturer 
>> (say BMW).  The NBA would want to provide each of its franchisees with a 
>> .nba name, for instance lakers.nba.  They might also want to 
>> register/protect the names of all the players, as well as provide names to 
>> authorized ticket vendors, merchandise vendors, etc.  In the case of BMW, 
>> they might want to issue a domain name to each authorized dealership, repair 
>> facility, or authorized fan club. 
>> 
>> It is just as silly to make them go to a registrar to do all of this stuff 
>> as it would be for them to use a registrar just to give out emails.  
>> Essentially, a middleman with no added value. 
>> 
>> Antony
>> 
>> 
>> On Mar 25, 2010, at 10:01 AM, Stéphane Van Gelder wrote:
>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Avri,
>>>> 
>>>> (JR) In my opinion it is ok for brand TLDs to give out names to consumers 
>>>> if the names are very tightly connected to the brand owner’s (online) 
>>>> services. But also then there would be the question of unfair competition 
>>>> with “open “ TLDs.  However, we need to keep in mind that running a big 
>>>> TLD is a relatively costly business, so I don’t see many TLDs just giving 
>>>> names out just for fun.
>>> 
>>> (SVG) I don't see how that can work. Either the brand TLD operator has to 
>>> own all of its domains and cannot distribute them to third parties (which 
>>> doesn't prevent the brand owner from leasing names out or entrusting them 
>>> to others BTW), and that way the registrar requirement may not be needed, 
>>> or the brand TLD operator is allowed to give or sell names to third parties 
>>> and in that case the playing field should be even with all other TLDs that 
>>> do distribute names and the TLD operator should have to work through ICANN 
>>> registrars.
>>> 
>>> Thanks,
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Stéphane Van Gelder
>>> Directeur Général / General manager
>>> +33 1 48 01 83 51
>>> 
>>> INDOM Noms de domaine / Domain names
>>> 124-126, rue de Provence
>>> 75008 Paris
>>> France
>>> 0820 77 7000 (Prix d'un appel local) 
>>> De l'étranger (calling from outside France): + 33 1 76 70 05 67
>>> www.indom.com
>>> 
>>> Daily domain name industry news: www.domaines.info
>>> Mon blog/My blog : www.stephanevangelder.com
>>> Twitter : stephvg
>> 
>